Shinobi Life Online
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: TheStylee on May 06, 2017, 10:50:34
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"Is SLO still a thing? Do developers work like...for real? Why are dev-blogs released so rarely? Why are the updates so slow? We have all thought about it. "This game is so dope but the devs are kind of too lazy? Why does it progress so slow?"
A topic that is discussed frequently in this community:- The game's progress rate. Well, this week I invited a few of us, members of the community, but with different points of view to answer these questions. This means:
1. One of the most logical thing to do is to ask the devs themselves about it. Their voice is their social media manager, Malix. I asked him about himeself, so we can get to know him better, how work's going on there, and what's happening behind the scene...
2. The second point of view that I was curious about was from a moderator, but one of the oldest ones, Nova. He is a moderator from 4th August 2015 as he says and considering his time spent on Discord, where most of the discussions take place, he may give us a neutral point of view about all of this.
3. An old player that doesn't wish to publish his name.
4. A new player. One of the most pure point of view is from the new ones. Because they see it clearly. No friendships. No enemies. Just a neutral point of view. As he's one of the new players that use the SLO-Discord, I invited Basaka for an interview about our game progress."
Now,let's find out together what the fuark is happening here :)
Note:I'd appreciate a lot if you may comment about 'ur opinion about it,once u've heard this guys opinion.
Note2:Thank you a lot @Shivraj for helping me on editing and adapting the texts.My english spaghetti is saved.
Me:Hi Malix,and welcome to our interview!
Malix:Hi Style,nice to be part of it!
Me:I'd like to ask,first of all,who is Malix.Malix in real life.Who are you?Where do you live?What's your age?Maybe even a name
Malix: Not gonna give my name because personal reasons,but..
Me:Whatever you feel ok with.
Malix:I'm 31, from Toronto, Canada. I test software for a living specifically i manage the test automation team.
I have an Electrical Engineering degree, a wife, a kid, a house, a car, a mortgage T.T
Me:That's a ...when the hell do you have time to work on SLO lmao ^^
Well,nice to meet the real you,Malix.
Malix:I work on lore on my train rides to and from work.Straight up and thank you.
Me:Im Alex,and ill try to ask you the most unconfortable questions i can and get out of you the truth.
Malix:Do your worst, keep in mind im the social media manager so i should be able to handle it :D
Me:How did you found SLO? :)
Malix:I found it on reddit in the Naruto sub as one of the few online games
Me:Nice to hear that we are everywhere,haha.
What made you to join the SLO team ?
Malix:Well ive been a pretty big naruto fan for the last 10 years, I've been a part of game development before, i'm in the software development industry irl aaaannddd i like to write. So when i saw the SMM contest I felt i could do that pretty well and I wanted to be a part of it. This is a pretty crazy dream come true for a me as Im sure it is for many people
Me:It is,indeed.
How do you feel about the other devs?Is there any misunderstandings between you guys?
Malix:There are disagreements sure, but rarely are there any full blown arguments.
Which makes sense really, if you didnt like the team/project you can leave whenever...and on the other hand we disagree about implementations all the time. Thats the point of having a discussion.
Me:Nice to hear a subjective opinion from inside.
How do you feel about Vreg?Was there any moment that he disappointed you?Made you feel proud you are part of the team?
Malix:Ive said it before and I'll say it again, Vreg and the rest of the team are extremely talented for their age. I'm 31 years old and I've been in the SWD industry for years and it's very rare to get talent like this from such a young age. Now we do have some old timers lately and they're great too. It really lets us keep the standard for work high. Ive never been overly disappointed. People forget this is a non-paid voluntary project in which the head developer was until very recently still a student.
Ive been around enough to know this is expected.
On the other hand I can understand how people on the outside can wonder why it doesn't look like anything is happening because they don't get to see what's going on.
Me:I understood.
Do you have any special conssideration for a member of the team?Do you dislike any of SLO members in a express way?
Malix:There arent enough arguments to dislike anyone. Although i think it would be cool to settle disputes in the SLO arena if we had any.
Altough i think Saitou deserves more recognition than he gets. Being a project manager is a thankless job that most people take for granted. While Vreg and the other guys make all the magic, it's Saitou that keeps us feeling like a team and keeps the ball rolling.
Me:How's going on on lore?Does it begin to catch the contour you are expecting?
Malix:The general history outline is done, ive written a first draft, then scrapped it and rewritten a second draft. I think im on my 4th now
I know what i want, im just a perfectionist
Me:Nice to hear that!Hard work is going on there.
As a social media manager,how do you feel about community?Does it motivates you?Did you made any friends from community?
Malix:We got an excited group of guys in our community. It's great to see all the suggestions (good and bad) and discussions that come out. As well as all the fan-made content. They're definitely dedicated to the game and I've gotten into more than one debate over future features. I thoroughly welcome that and it does motivate me as I want you guys to like the work that I, and the whole team, put out. I'd like to think that I'm everyone's friend! But I'll settle with just the Hidden Metal guys...cuz we're clearly the best.
Me:Fair enough,metal guy.
You actually made the job easier for me,cause that's the subject i wanted to talk with you about now.
Me:After the release of the game,how we'll find Malix?A metal rogue guy?A troller?Do you have any early ideeas about how your character will be builded?
Malix:Hmm well I know I'll concentrate on Genjutsu and I'll be a Metal shinobi for the long run. I take my village choice (and eventually my clan choice) seriously. I'm not one to bounce around a lot. I do hope we'll have some sort of crafting system though, I'd like to be a blacksmith of some sort.
Overall I think I'll lead a quiet life, I dont have as much time to play as others
Also I want to be working on writing future events
Me:Great thing,now i know where i can upgrade my weapons ! xD
Well Malix,i have a verry last question for you.
We would like to hear an opinion from inside.As i said,there was a topic on discord channel where some of us argued about game progress ration.Do you think it is slow?fast enough?what's happening on background?
Malix:Well again everyone has real lives to take care of and that comes first. From my perspective things are going at the regular pace although recently we've added new members to the team that have really let us start developing more things at once. Now if you want to compare us to some other game than of course we're probably slow but that's just how it'll go until the kickstarter is under way. I suspect all the gripes about development speed will suddenly disappear then.
Me:I understood.Thanks a lot for your time Malix.Was a pleasure.
Malix:Thanks for having me, the pleasure is mine.
Me: Hi Nova!And welcome!
Nova: Hi Style !
Me: Who is Nova? Tell us all the personal informations you are comfortable to share with us.
Nova: "Nova" is the same as all the other people on the forum, just a gamer who looked for a Naruto mmorpg.
More specifically, I'm Dutch and 19 years old (atm), Been a part of the forum since august 4th 2015.
Me: I guess I should introduce myself too. I'm Alex, 19 years too, and I'll try to guide you through this interview journey
Me: How did you found SLO?
Nova: After catching up on the anime back then, I figured it could've been a great setting for an mmorpg, so the first thing I did was load up google and search for "Naruto mmorpg" SLO was one of the first if not the first entry to show up.
I tried out the game, got on and saw 2 members arguing, was hooked to the community since.
Me: What is your general opinion about all of SLO - the shinobi life simulator?
Nova: Twisted, I love both the project (what they aim to become) and the community, however it does have it's drawbacks mainly caused by some of the members.
Me: Cruel as usual.
Me: As a moderator, how do you feel about the community? Have you formed tight friendships? Have you made any enemies? Or maybe people that you just completely dislike?
Nova: I've made quite a few friends on this project, who I hold quite dearly, some of which are inactive now.
Majority of the friends I made still contact me once in a while, and with a few of them we represent Yurei.
As for enemies, I haven't made any as far as I'm concerned, the only thing that I dislike from time to time is the behavior of some of the members(not the people themselves.)
Take Mars as an example, he's one of the first friends I made on this project, and I really do like him as a friend, however due to his troll-side I often have to take action against him (even though I'd rather not =/)
Me: What's your relationship with Shivraj,the other younger moderator?
Nova: He's one of the friends I made on this project, both being ex-Himitsu members (same goes for Reminance, Mars, Ken, Vipto etc.)
I still like him as a friend, even if we were "enemies" at one point (he is one of the leaders in katakiuchi and I was a roguehunter in Roguhanta)
He's also a fellow yurei member.
Me: Today, we had a topic on the official SLO Discord server: The game's progress rate. Do you find it slow, moderate or just fast enough?
Nova: I do think that the updates-rate is slow, but I do realize that me moaning about it won't magically speed up the progress.
It all comes down the devs (mostly Vreg).
Me: How's your relationship with Vreg?From outside,he pings@ you anytime something is botherhing him.Is this relationship beautifull inside as it seems from outside?
Nova: Eh, not sure if I'd call it an relationship, technically speaking he's my "employer" I just do my job by keeping the forum and community remotely clean.
As for why he @'s me, I'm not entirely sure, might be because he expects I'll do it well enough (or that he doesn't want to be bothered with such things himself)
Me: Nice to hear that ^^
Me: Do you have any goals about SLO? Do you wish to remain in team even further?
Nova: No specific goals set for SLO, I hope I'll be around when the game releases so I can play the game I've been waiting for.
As for my place in the team, I don't mind whatever the outcome, I like the dev team and I don't mind moderating, however it's not like I feel the need to be a moderator.
Nova: Don't get me wrong, I'm not thinking of stepping down, but should somebody worthy show up I wouldn't mind stepping down
Me: How're things going on in the background? I heard that you guys get some new members on team . Did you meet them ?
Nova: I've seen some of the new devs talk on the chat, but it's mostly the people who are working on finalizing the trailer atm that actively talk / try to fix stuff with Vreg.
Me: I understood.
Me: Last question, who will be Nova in game? Do you have an early concept about your character? ^^
Nova: My plans for the released game (at this moment, don't know about the future) is to roam around and explore the map after training for a bit.
Of course I'll also be putting in work for my clan, so they can have a good time.
And last but not least, I'll be doing stuff Yurei related.
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Disclaimer:The old player that i interviewed, he wanted to remain anonim and don't get his name published.I respected his wish,but questions about himself would be pointless.So i asked him just about his opinnion about the game-progress ration,our main topic.
Here it is:
"In the past 2 years there has been little to no development codingwise. Sure we've got new graphics but in 2 years all we have got is: Wind bullet, earth dome, earth wall and just recently extremely basic kenjutsu. I know Vreg has been busy however 4 new features in 2 years? It shouldn't take 6 months to make a jutsu or kenjutsu move. It seems as if Vreg is slacking and throwing constant excuses about being busy, but even if he just spent at least 15 minutes developing every night we'd have a lot more features than that added in two years. Myself and others have lost most hope in the game and only stay for the community. I feel as if once Vreg settles down with his job he needs to put a lot more effort in to the game, and if that's not possible he needs to be honest and say he's lost motivation, as that's what it seems like to me."
Me:Hi Basaka,and welcome!
Basaka:Hi Style,nice to be here!
Me:First of all,i'd like to meet the Black Jesus of the discord.Share with us all the personal info you are confortable to.What's your name?Where do you live?How old are you?
Basaka:Ibrahim rafi (real name), Bristol in the UK and I am 15 right now
Me:Nice to meet you,Rafi.Im Alex,and ill guide you through this majestic interview.
One thing that im curious about,How did you found SLO ?
Basaka:I just started naruto 3 months ago, and I wanted to see if there was a free naruto game and came across this, on YouTube.
Me:Wow,so you're a rocky of naruto series.
Basaka:Yeah I am very new lol
Me:As you know,you're one of the youngest people around him that use discord and play the game.What's the first experience you had with this project?
Basaka:Ummmm, well I think the game has a very good idea to it. However most of the ideas seem like they won't be available for at least a few years. I can see a future, but right now it seems to be not as bright as before due to the promised updates never coming. Right now i enjoy the game but that's only when people I know are on. Usually it is quite boring.
Me :That's the honestly level i want you to share with me.Well done.
Today,a topic that u can find in discord channel was about game progress ration.Do you think it's to slow?Fast enough?
Basaka :The progress is extremely slow right now, apparently the game has been out for years and has only had a handful of changes. I don't completely blame the developers, but I do think that they could spend more time working on the game.
Me:Have you made any friends from this community?
Basaka:Yes actually, I'm surprised to say that the community is the best part of this game and I have made plenty of friends through this.
Me:Is there any member of the community you like in a special way?
Basaka: I can't really say because I haven't been here long enough, but right now I like most people.
Me:Do you have any goals about SLO?do you wish to remain in community even further?
Basaka:The only goals I have is to have updates be much more regularly as most of the players in the discord server have admitted to only visit the forums for the community. This is also surprisingly one of the most chill communities I have seen for a while so, yeah I want to remain in the community for longer.
Me:One last question.If the project get done in the end,how your character will looks like?Some info like..specialisation?Like genjutsu,maybe ninjutsu?What village do you preffer?
Basaka:My village would be the hidden hill, and my character would specialise in ninjutsu and tai jutsu. However he would also have the logo of his clan on his shirt.
Me:Thank you a lot Basaka!Was a pleasure!
Basaka:Thank you too!
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welp i thought it was obvious that progress is slow cause vreg and the entire dev team have jobs
they're not being paid so they can only dedicate spare time to this project
but good idea tho
P.S. Someone else did a series of interviews, diamond lee??? so idk if this is first edition idk rip
EDIT: +rep
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welp i thought it was obvious that progress is slow cause vreg and the entire dev team have jobs
they're not being paid so they can only dedicate spare time to this project
but good idea tho
P.S. Someone else did a series of interviews, diamond lee??? so idk if this is first edition idk rip
It was DiamondLee indeed,but that's the first version with style.Literally. ;D
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I mean, you've just thrown information into this thread that most people already knew. Besides, nobody is complaining, they understand the reasoning.
Oh well, this may be useful to beginners in the community.
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I mean, you've just thrown information into this thread that most people already knew. Besides, nobody is complaining, they understand the reasoning.
Oh well, this may be useful to beginners in the community.
That's right.Most of the informations here are for begginers and people that don't use discord and just visit forum by time to time to check for new updates.Also,i thought you guys will find interesing what Malix said : "recently we've added new members to the team that have really let us start developing more things at once".
^^
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Enjoyed reading it tbh.gj
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Great effort mate. Good job.
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interesting to read, nice.
good job ^^
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I am Stylee is majestic.
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Since i dont know much about the community and we always get some new players,i really appreciate this.
Nice to see a interview with,,style'' ;)
Really enjoyed reading this,i hope you keep doing this and interview people about events aswell(should there be any).
Would also like to see more interviews about new players,who decided to stay around.
+1 rep.
This really is a nice idea to make the game feel more,,alive''.
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rip rip triggered
technically wasn't that bad. I'm not going to get butt hurt or anything so nice job! I'm lazy, you aren't !
rip can't help but feel pain when I read slo interviews first edition tho
heh
anyways
Nice!
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Well, I hope you don't continue with the same topic.
I'd like to know about the person you are interviewing more than their thoughts about this game.
I guess everyone has this notion that the game is SLOw in terms of development and is getting boring for some.
Looking forward for future interviews.
How about SLO interviews Season 2 edition 1
Or something like that. Give lil Lee some Courtesy. I feel bad for him. Although yeah he slacked off.
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I feel like i learned a lot about Malix.
nice.
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I feel like i learned a lot about Malix.
nice.
word big time learnz
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I agree tho with the anonymous interviewee, it seems like they probably WOULD have more if even only 15 mins a day was spent working on the game. Fifteen minutes a day for two years, one of which being a leap year, that's 731 days. That's 10,965 minutes of time spent on the game, which SHOULD be enough time to get a little more done than we have already, and if ALL the devs did that, then it would be 10,965 minutes per dev, which means we could have had a LOT more finished. Just saying.
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I agree tho with the anonymous interviewee, it seems like they probably WOULD have more if even only 15 mins a day was spent working on the game. Fifteen minutes a day for two years, one of which being a leap year, that's 731 days. That's 10,965 minutes of time spent on the game, which SHOULD be enough time to get a little more done than we have already, and if ALL the devs did that, then it would be 10,965 minutes per dev, which means we could have had a LOT more finished. Just saying.
Tutor me maths pls
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I agree tho with the anonymous interviewee, it seems like they probably WOULD have more if even only 15 mins a day was spent working on the game. Fifteen minutes a day for two years, one of which being a leap year, that's 731 days. That's 10,965 minutes of time spent on the game, which SHOULD be enough time to get a little more done than we have already, and if ALL the devs did that, then it would be 10,965 minutes per dev, which means we could have had a LOT more finished. Just saying.
Tutor me maths pls
XD
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I agree tho with the anonymous interviewee, it seems like they probably WOULD have more if even only 15 mins a day was spent working on the game. Fifteen minutes a day for two years, one of which being a leap year, that's 731 days. That's 10,965 minutes of time spent on the game, which SHOULD be enough time to get a little more done than we have already, and if ALL the devs did that, then it would be 10,965 minutes per dev, which means we could have had a LOT more finished. Just saying.
By this math that`s about 183 hours which if you did an hour a day would be about 26 weeks worth. I guarantee you more work than that has been put into this by Vreg and Matt and some other long timers. Hell I`ve put in many hours over the Christmas break on something we didn`t end up using (sadface.jpg).
Not all the devs are coders, nor are they animators, nor are they all writers or concept artists. So you cant expect us all to be doing the same job. We also have day jobs and our own lives, so some days are just not available. On top of that many of our team members have changed over the months, I myself have only been here since September.
So while yes if I was being paid, i would consider quitting my job and working on this 40 hours a week as this project is something I enjoy. But right now that`s not going to pay my mortgage sooo I`ll stick to the 90 min a weekday (450 min a week) I currently spend on it.
#justsaying
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I agree tho with the anonymous interviewee, it seems like they probably WOULD have more if even only 15 mins a day was spent working on the game. Fifteen minutes a day for two years, one of which being a leap year, that's 731 days. That's 10,965 minutes of time spent on the game, which SHOULD be enough time to get a little more done than we have already, and if ALL the devs did that, then it would be 10,965 minutes per dev, which means we could have had a LOT more finished. Just saying.
Although you are right that development has dropped off a bit in general, for me, and a lot of the members (who are still in education) this is largely due to it really being crunch time in terms of exams. This has a knock on effect - as when members see less work being done they in turn have less motivation to get work done themselves, and thus little gets completed as a whole. There are also other members, who have personal or work related issues, for instance our new UI developer got a kidney stone and was thus unable to complete the initial new UI mockup that was set for him, which was also meant to be the visual benchmark for the next stage of the website design. Vreg is the main component in this obviously as project lead, and with him really underestimating how much his job would take out of him in weekdays, he currently only has the weekend available for development. This is something Vreg freely realizes and acknowledges and is something we are discussing in how he is going to have to free up more time. Obviously the general pace of development is unacceptable right now considering the array of talent we have in the team currently thanks to Saitou.
However, to get to your comment about 15 minutes per day, if you have any experience with any type of development or work in general, it simply is pointless to work that amount of time, you will have barely sat down to work by the time your 'development period' is over. To get any real work done you have to sit down for a few hours at a time, and naturally that is not something most of us can do consistently at the moment, as it will have negative impacts on our other work. We will have to wait to see how this changes over the coming months. Personally, once ive finished my exams after June, i have the next year totally free to work on concepts for the game, and im sure lots of the members will have similar situations in being more free after exams.
Until then, EE signing out.
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I agree tho with the anonymous interviewee, it seems like they probably WOULD have more if even only 15 mins a day was spent working on the game. Fifteen minutes a day for two years, one of which being a leap year, that's 731 days. That's 10,965 minutes of time spent on the game, which SHOULD be enough time to get a little more done than we have already, and if ALL the devs did that, then it would be 10,965 minutes per dev, which means we could have had a LOT more finished. Just saying.
If you have made a game, I will take your opinion on board and say "Okay." as well as the anonymous interviewees too. If not though, nor even tried. I am going to have to smh at your comments about the progression. Making a game is not easy. More so with a small team. Whilst SLO does well to recruit people, you have to understand not all people will give their time for free to get the project on the road. Nor should they.
As for your 15mins a day theory, I am going to have to say I disagree. Say they did 15 minutes a day, that could be slower than when they get a whole day to put in one day that makes up for the days they couldn't. What my point here is that you can't say it would be faster without knowing how much they do right now.
Progress doesn't show for many theoretical reasons other than "Laziness"; Which seems to be a common choice by many. It could be the fact that they worked on several jutsu but did not go through with them because of coding bugs or the fact it didn't fit. Maybe they found there is important things needed to be fixed server side or even more important back-end things needed to be made prior to getting some colorful jutsu out.
What a lot of you need to realise is that the thing we have now is not meant to be the MMO. Not by a long shot. It is something they made and add to now and then to keep us entertained whilst they work on the actual project. Yes, some stuff in the current thing we have now will help move the project forward such as buildings that we get to test and MAYBE the jutsu (IF no trademark on them. we may get a whole different lot of jutsu.)
There is so much more to making a game then the stuff you actually see and the back-end stuff is hard as fuck to do. You fix one bug and it could create 5 more out of no where and that's just the coding side of back-end; It's hard work. So unless you actually comprehend what goes into getting an MMO project off the ground, don't try to complain about progression. Because the stuff we have right now? Is not the MMO they are developing but a thing they gift to us to tryout in a sandbox which we should be happy they even do whilst working on the game itself.
To sum up: Stop bitching unless you know what you are talking about and find other things to do if you are bored with what the sandbox has for now.