block defence and ninja tool training system

[NinjaMirage]

in short dice rolls.
you train your kenjutsu throw like kunai shuriken and senbon with a 3 sided dice to start
if the target shows no defence dice or attack dice is higher the attack connects
if the target shows a equal or higher value for their dice roll i.e atack shows 1 def shows 3 the attack is blocked

now both are attack and defence are trained the same way after rolling say 30 3's
they move up to a 6 sided dice after 60 6's
they move up to a 9 sidded dice
then a 12 sided
and i don't think there is a thing but computer dice rolls aren't limited to 3 dimensional objects... so there is no reason this can't keep going to 1000 sided dice.

by this time you are a jonin,you still must block(hold the block key) the kunai shuriken senbon whatever
but there is only a 1 in 8.2 chance that you cannot block it IF YOU ARE ROLLING A 24 SIDED DICE. against a noob.

you can get credit for blocking attacks in battle but its not smart to rely only on this... there should be a training ground with a npc to throw training kuni
at you so you can train dice rolls.(this is were a lot of people will probably just tape the b key down and go to lunch). you will not be able to do that with attack rolls because they must be targeted.  also the higher the number on your attack dice role i believe should impact the damage inflicted with that attack (as it would represent how close to vital organs and pressure points the attack hit)this would mean that some one that only trains in Kenjutsu would have the skill to aim for the heart or neck and inflict serious damage.with some level of chance involved.
again noobs start with a 3 sided dice not a lot of damage there.

this is ok for balance because there is still a level of luck involved and
there are other jutsu to limit the damage you take. not to mention it will train people to never underestimate a opponent

[Tameshi Hinode]

I really dont want to look like,,that guy''who disagrees with everything you write,but i have to do it once more.

Dice rolls are fine for crits,as long as they dont become too op.
But in a action combat system,RNG(thats what dice rolls are about)should be limited.
Dodging or blocking should always happen because of your skill.
Either your tactical skill(because you have been smart enough to prepare a certain jutsu before)or your reflexes(because you have been fast enough to doge/block)but never because of luck.
This might work in tab target mmos but not here.
If you are good enough to block a incomming attack,you block it.
Crits are fine,because you have to get hit in the first place,to receive a critical hit.
But i dont think you should get punished randomly,for doing nothing wrong(or from a other perspective,getting rewarded for little to no effort).

[NinjaMirage]

OK..so if understand correctly you have 2 issues with this .

1. there needs to be a cap on the levels(sides)of dice rolls
2.if you see it coming and are skilled enough to time the block on contact it negates the dice rolls.but at what skill level will this take effect?

i agree with both of these point. btw.

however. block still needs to be trained somehow.. and this method makes the most sense to me. any time you have a flying projectile that is interfered with like a rickisha or block there is a element of chance involved if you mistime the block.

[Tameshi Hinode]

Mistiming a block doesnt have to be decided by dices because weve got a action combat system allready.
My issue isnt that there should be more or less sides on the dices,my issue is that these dices shouldnt exist at all.
Youre either good enough to block or you arent.

You can still,,train''your block,though.
Its not uncommon in sandbox mmo,s to train your block/health the same way as your attacks or ressourse gathering skills.
So,if you block often,you will get better at it.
And if you get better at blocking,it could waste less stamina,your block could be ready faster,you could block more damage,the impact of the attack doesnt knock you away so far if you worked on your block before,some debuffs could be weakened if youre good at blocking.....there are many ways to simulate the training of your block.
You would just have to sparr with someone.
The more you block,the better you get at it.
Its realistic,easy to understand,entertaining,RP-conform and has no need for dice rolls.

[NinjaMirage]

so then damage will be decided by buffs and whether or not it hits you.

buffs are = to the amount of training you put into them, and successfully achieve?

so should they based on a % of total stamina say for blocking and at different levels this percentage goes down?

[Tameshi Hinode]

I wouldnt say buffs......more like,,passive skills''.
Blocking would be a skill that you can,,upgrade''by using it.
So yes,the more you succesfully block a attack,the higher your blocking skill will be.
And a higher blocking skill could reward you with all kind of advantages like using less stamina to block,for example.

[Mars]

ya

[NinjaMirage]

ok so say bass PE =1000 or something like this
bass block PE rq= 200  to start i think this is about the right ratio
and 100 blocks per level
train block level 1=(PE x.01)-bass block PE=190 pe cost to block
"          "     "     2=(PE x.015)-"  "  " =155
                        3=(PE x .02)-  "  "   =60
                        4=level 3-1            =59
                        5=          -2              58
                        and so on
however you earn 10% of bass block PE back to your bass PE Reserves for each successful block and 5% more every level after level three you continue to gain 5%
till level 4 as well for a 25% for every block
so level 1 1020 total
    level 2 3030
    level 3 7040
    level 4 ?50

[Dragon6624]

So yes, the more you successfully block an attack, the higher your blocking skill will be; and a higher blocking skill could reward you with all kind of advantages like--for example--using less stamina to block.

I believe what Tameshi meant by this is not that you would 'gain back' stamina -- but that you would instead 'use less' for each block. The system you (cmsurfer) have created doesn't--at least in my mind--make much sense; why would you gain stamina for expending it? The system you have would work a lot better as a streamlined chakra-theft jutsu, or something along those lines.

Since--correct me if I'm wrong here--I'm quite sure this game will be skill/stat based in the sense of Runescape (i.e training specific skill lines such as cooking, strength, speed, etc to get better at them individually), I don't think you'll automatically be getting more stamina per level, or if you'll even have uniform 'Player Levels'. In this sense, blocking will--as Tameshi stated above--be trained in much the same way; the more you accomplish actions using the skill of blocking ranged projectiles, the more efficient you'll be at it -- or the more you train your stamina, the higher it'll get. This is not to say that skills will entirely take over your gameplay, just the aspects of it that really can't be directly controlled by a player; i.e no player is going to want to play a minigame to stir a pot for cooking each time they want soup, or attempt to spastically flail their cursor across the screen trying to block minute shuriken attacks.

I'd agree with Tameshi's comment on being able to achieve passives or additional riders/perks the higher you train your blocking skill--or any skill, really--but I've yet to read any chance of something like that getting implemented, so I'm a bit wary there.

[NinjaMirage]

So yes, the more you successfully block an attack, the higher your blocking skill will be; and a higher blocking skill could reward you with all kind of advantages like--for example--using less stamina to block.

I believe what Tameshi meant by this is not that you would 'gain back' stamina -- but that you would instead 'use less' for each block. The system you (cmsurfer) have created doesn't--at least in my mind--make much sense; why would you gain stamina for expending it?

ok so The PE system is based on Strength stamina and dexterity get your total PE
you gety stamina by spending in just like your gain stamina the more you run- the more you run the less effort it take to run so the further you can run. in a way you get more stamina by using it. so all these add to the total stat.

Since--correct me if I'm wrong here--I'm quite sure this game will be skill/stat based in the sense of Runescape (i.e training specific skill lines such as cooking, strength, speed, etc to get better at them individually), I don't think you'll automatically be getting more stamina per level, or if you'll even have uniform 'Player Levels'. In this sense, blocking will--as Tameshi stated above--be trained in much the same way; the more you accomplish actions using the skill of blocking ranged projectiles, the more efficient you'll be at it -- or the more you train your stamina, the higher it'll get. This is not to say that skills will entirely take over your gameplay, just the aspects of it that really can't be directly controlled by a player; i.e no player is going to want to play a minigame to stir a pot for cooking each time they want soup, or attempt to spastically flail their cursor across the screen trying to block minute shuriken attacks.

i agree with this to...you train in strength get strength cooking takes dexterity stain your stamina you get stamina
every action you take would would fall in to one of the 6 categories in my other suggestions.
I.E. intelligent charizma,imagination  for SE and
Strength stamina and dexterity for PE
after a fight just add up how many times you made contact with a punch blocked dodged used genjutsu left the player alive or killed him and its added to the respective skill values. no levels not skill points assigning. you just get add energy to your previous total for the experience you were just involved with.
there is no experience bars its all simple addition. 6 skills add up to 2 overall stats that are used to make chakra and increase your battle strength
as for the actual block coast this can also go down based on a level of training in block. you could even sat that block could use both strength and dexterity at a certain point you might be able to train to increase the power of the block this way. 

the above was a early idea of how it could work this way i think is better

so the character stats in the current build i generated gave him 390 dexterity-only a fraction of his total PE
to start block should run off this value.(dexterity is stuff like reflexes ,accuracy, and small movements like crafting) 
coast by training            successful block experience
level 1-  50                                   +1
        2-  49                                   +1
        3-  48                                   +1
all the way to level 50 when it no longer costs anything to block
the levels then only represent you skill at blocking.
some time around 20 or so you should start getting +1 back to strength as well or any kind of buff to increase the rewards for a clean block
FPS speed of your blocks could even be based on the total dexterity, A % of it to make it faster with each level of block

you gain levels by successfully blocking
level 1 -   5 blocks
level 2 -   10
and so on ... the numbers we just need to figure out to make balanced in over all game progression.

[Dragon6624]

Okay, so the PE system is based on Strength, Stamina and Dexterity, which adds to your total PE. You get stamina by spending points in it, just like you gain stamina the more you run; the more you run the less effort it takes, so the further you can run. In a way you get more stamina by using it. So, all of these add to the total PE stat.

While I understand what you're trying to say, my own counterpoint is that it doesn't have to be that complicated. The more you run, the better you get at running, and the less energy you spend. There isn't any need to add an extra system that gives you back expended energy, as you're already using less -- you wouldn't be able to gain that extra energy because it isn't there anymore.

As for the end of your reply,  yes, that's what I already said -- minus total PE and SE stat part. I haven't read whichever post you made on those points yet, so I'm out of context on where you're coming from on that one. Perhaps a link to the correct topic would help me understand your point there a bit more.

I'm feeling a bit worn down from reading so much--various other topics--for the day, so expect a reply tomorrow if you have anything extra to add.

[json243]

All this math has me like